Change in the method we run loot

[Eleth]

All,

   First i think that I need to make clear, we are not abandoning DKP or anything similar, however we will be changing the process we use to on runs for people to loot. The following changes will be used going forward:

1) We will be using a whisper system for loot. Once an item is called you need to whisper the person running loot if you are interested with either 'Main' if it is for your main spec (and will be 100% DKP cost), or 'Off', for an off spec (and will be 50% DKP cost). The person running loot will then do a 10 second countdown (holds can still be called) and then will announce who has whispered an interest. Loot will then go out based on the DKP table same as now.

EG: Eleth announces [great ring] loot, starts
Eleth counts : 10
Helwin whispers :   Main
Eleth counts : 9
Bazerk whispers :   Off
Eleth counts : 8
Eleth counts : 7
Mukaka whispers:  Main
Fallwynd whispers:  Off
Eleth counts : 6..5..4..3..2..1.

Eleth announces:  Main:  Helwin, Mukaka   < --- so people can check that they were not missed
                          Off:   Bazerk,Fallwynd

Mains take precedence over offs (same as current), so we would lookup Helwin and Mukaka on the DKP sheet and the highest DKP would win, same as now.
Any whispers received after 0 will be ignored, and in case of disagreement please raise it Immediately and we will SS upload to resolve.

2) If no-one indicated 'Main' or 'Off' interest then the item will go to a random roll use (meaning a NO DKP charge, the idea here is to reduce sharding). You should only roll here if the item will actually be used, and in the case of BoE items you will be asked to equip immediately to bind.

3)Certain special items or items of significant impact eg: the eye pendant from KT, will be dealt with outside of the DKP system (this was already being done, but we wanted to make the process more open/clear, and plan for such items before they drop rather than trying to come up with something fast on the fly to reduce the risk of mistakes/bad decisions). A new thread will be started which will list all such items before we have them dropped, specifying the item, and what will be done with it in the event that it drops.
EG:

Item	Decision
[Great key for killing Arthas]	First 3 will go to officers, at a cost of 300DKP, after 3 are in the guild, the rest will be dealt with via the normal DKP system

 We expect there to be very very few items on this list, and we would encourage people to comment on the items/proposed decisions before the item actually drops! The idea is to resolve any disagreement before the situation is encountered.

[magnum]

I like to know who is rolling on an item.. For example.  if kylit rolls need I don't normaly roll against him on tank loot.    Not sure what prompted the change but I saw nothing wrong with how we did loot.

[Mukaka]

With the old way, an unscrupulous pally might try to get an item that they truly needed -- at half-price -- by waiting until it got to the use roll. If someone first rolled during the need countdown, only then would the shady pally roll need. Sending the need/use via whisper will make it more difficult for the cheating pallies to "game the loot distribution". (Of course I use "pallies" purely as an example here) 

After the count reaches zero, all the need/use rollers will be displayed. If the need rollers are declared to be Magnum and Kylit, Magnum can at this point chose to pass to Kylit.

One point I'd like to make. Due to lag issues, you should make sure to get your tell into the master looter well before the count reaches 0. I'd suggest trying to get the tell by the 2-count (adjusting to a higher count if your lag is really bad). If you wait til the last second and the message round-trip causes you to come in after 0, then you lose. So in your mind, consider that the countdown goes, "5, 4, 3, 0" 

If you need to hold the countdown, you can still request that.

[Ahpre (aka Ahmaj)]

... at this point chose to pass to Kylit.

I think you should only be allowed to pass if there is another bidder in your "category" (i.e. if you are only bidder in "main" you cannot pass to "off"). 

[magnum]

Magnum has scruples the size of pineapples ...   

[Aniral]

... at this point chose to pass to Kylit.

I think you should only be allowed to pass if there is another bidder in your "category" (i.e. if you are only bidder in "main" you cannot pass to "off"). 

I realize that this discussion may be meant to be member-only, so I apologize if you guys would rather I stayed out. However, I have to ask, Ahmaj: why do you think this? It often happens that someone bids on something, and then reconsiders their decision, because they'd rather have another piece, so they don't want to waste DKP on this one. With your proposal, you're effectively saying that in some situations you can't change your mind... which might be fine, but you need to ask yourselves what is gained by the policy to offset that loss of decision-making freedom.

[Mukaka]

I think Ahmaj's point is that if you saw that you were the only one bidding as main-spec, and your friend was the only one bidding as alt-spec -- you could pass on it so your friend would get it at half price.

As far as changing your mind at the last minute and wanting to retract. I know I've made some bad decisions in the haste of the loot roll, but I have little sympathy for myself because I should have a good idea of my upgrades before walking into the raid, or at least an addon that summarizes the changes nicely.

[Ahpre (aka Ahmaj)]

Exactly Muk. 

If these changes were done simply to reduce the amount of sharding it could have easily been remedied by implementing the "use roll" with no other changes.  Since we have gone to this "secret" ballot type of request it would lead me to believe that there was a concern regarding the previous method of bidding.  If that is the case then we need to make it as "tamper proof" as possible.