Knights of Other Realms
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
January 22, 2018, 09:00:26 PM

Login with username, password and session length
Search:     Advanced search
Applicants - Contact Bazerk if you need to have your account approved.
Members - If you cannot see the Members-only boards, contact Bazerk.
23341 Posts in 3013 Topics by 352 Members
Latest Member: kelgore
* Home Help Search Login Register
+  Knights of Other Realms Forums
|-+  Questing and Grouping
| |-+  Looking For Group
| | |-+  What does he mean, "I'm on strike!"?
« previous next »
Pages: [1] Print
Author Topic: What does he mean, "I'm on strike!"?  (Read 1287 times)
ElvisElf
Guild Member
Newbie
*
Posts: 7


Email
« on: July 09, 2007, 05:34:56 PM »

I have noticed a general lack of intra-guild support for questing.  While I was leveling, I would post in guild chat that I was looking for help with some group quests.  I almost always never got any response.  So, I just left those quests alone (abandoned, didn't accept them, or left them in my log).  My log is/was practially full of group quests.  I started posting a few of them in GEM thinking that all guild members used GEM and I would see some support.  I rolled these quests over for three days and not a word.  Of course that's a short period to expect all of them to get done, but I expected at least one person to make a remark, but nothing.  At this point some people might be thinking, "well, Elvis - it's not always about you" -- I agree.  I know that there are several people that have a lot of quests not done because there is not guild support for it.  Here's the point - now that I'm 70 and can contribute to instance runs, I am being sought out.  I'm using this as a tool to raise the entire guild's awareness that a bunch of people are in need of help.  I, like others, would like to get through these quests so I can get on to the quest lines that lead to end-game material.

Until such time that we start helping eachother out more or I give up on my crusade, I will not be running raids or instances (well maybe a couple) in protest of other people's lack of guild cooperation.

Please, post here your comments regarding this subject.  Let me know that I'm a complete selfish jerk or let others know that you too would like to see each of us helping eachother out more.

As a caviate, I know that when someone posts in guild chat that they are in need of help that everyone in the guild isn't going to reply.  If however, people continually post, LFG... LFG for a few days and no one responds, then I think there's a guild problem.  What do you think?
Logged
Frosh
I'm not as fast as Frostburn.
Guild Officer
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1751

stevenearhart@yahoo.com StevenAtHouse
WWW Email
« Reply #1 on: July 09, 2007, 06:43:54 PM »

With Tuesday/Thursday/Sunday being raid nights, the officers (me for one) don't want to spend the time/effort/energy required to setup any form of 'official' questing.  However, if you would like to setup Wednesday night in GEM and post it on the forums, I think it will go a long way.

Why forums AND gem?  SImply put, I don't check GEM.  My schedule is full already, and I 'don't need' to use it Wink  But I check the boards religiously and it's more likely to attract attention. 

And on topic (though not directed at you, unless you meet this criteria):  Often when I see people looking for quests, it's ships passing in the night.  One person needs <x> another person needs <y> and another person needs <z>.  Too often, no one will sacrafice and help out <x> so that <x> can help out <y> etc...Group quests, especially, are notorious for this;  anyone else remember jailbreak? Wink  After one person suffers for hours to get a group, wipe 3 times because you forgot to clear the closet, and FINALLY get jailbreak done, going back and doing it again is daunting for some people; not that it excuses people from not helping a fellow guildy. Smiley

Another side note:  the best way to get help on quests (this is again not directed directly at elvis, but anyone who needs help with something that doesn't benefit other people directly) is to help out other people doing whatever they need (quests, items, enchants, who knows..)   Relationships are the key to doing 'crap quests' - build the relationships, and finding groups is much easier Smiley

Finally:  I like this post;  it addresses a topic accurately and brings it to the attention of the guild's members - hopefully people will respond positively,though i'm not certain a 'strike' is needed.  (I for one didn't know you need anything except for the questline in shadow moon which i offered to help after a run - i'm on all the time, but rarely actually read anything going on in guild because i have too many whispers/quests/pvp/raids/etc.. Smiley)
Logged

nymeriastark
Jr. Member
**
Posts: 80


Email
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2007, 09:11:58 PM »

:chuckles:
Guys, you shouldn't have to find in guild groups to get your things done.
I mean, I've never had a problem putting a group for something together, heroics included. You should always add competent players to your friendlist (of course, after asking their permission, who the f are you sort of response from a MT, or decked out priests/pallies are rather often, as I've learned).
It's a bonus if someone in guild happens to be free to help with a quest, but you are always allowed to join the LFG channel, and spam that for quests that other people would be interested in running with you.
I personally believe that people should be able to do their quests/dungeons themselves =P, part of the WoW adventure. Just sticking to your guildies can get rather boring ;-), as much as I love everyone.
Elvis, at least you're being sought out as a healer to gear up =P, the server is flooded with dps and dps and dps, harsh place for a huntard like me to find any place to live, but I survive =P.
A guild isn't there TO help you, it's a place that should encourage enjoyment of gaming for everyone. If they're done with the quest and don't want to help you... that's tough, if they haven't finished the quest and will do it with you - perfect, if they're free and can do it with ya - superb! But I mean expectations from guilds should really not be imposed in any way or form. =D
Logged
Xakopane
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 370



« Reply #3 on: July 09, 2007, 10:10:51 PM »

This evening Elviself, Agelaus, Elua, and Shalador did some groups quests in Nagrand. Agelaus was along for the ride as he'd done them all but I felt for Elviself in his plight and love questing. We then gathered up a generous Nalen and knocked out the excellent Ring of Blood quest. That is a ton of fun!

Looking forward to more group quest fun Elviself!

Xakopane/Agelaus
Logged
Jahira
Guild Member
Sr. Member
*
Posts: 251

Jahira Jahira
« Reply #4 on: July 10, 2007, 04:45:41 AM »

Posting stuff on GEM should get other people who need the quest as well.  It doesn't get people who have no personal interest in the quest to join... even if they would be willing to help otherwise.  If your GEM event doesn't fill up try actually whispering guild members and maybe even attempting to build some personal relationships that could lead to more cooperative play.

By the same token just asking in guild chat for help isn't going to get a robust response.  For the most part you are making a general broadcast to people who are already involved in other things.  You are asking them to drop what they are doing to help you.  I know that I am far more likely to respond to someone who asks me personally for help than to someone who is just asking in the general channel.  Even better.. someone who asks me to hep them some time before ....right now!.... for example.. "Hey Soandso I've posted a SMV questing day in GEM for tomorrow night.  I didn't get a full group signed up so far and I was wondering if I'd be able to get you to give me a hand with it if the group comes up short?"  Even if they can't help you at your preferred time you can usually com up with a different time that suites both of you.

In general I have found the members of this guild to be exceptionally helpful when approached in this manner.



A lot of your guild mates have done these quests very many times and are not jumping up and down to do them again.  That does not mean they won't but it does mean they won't be quick to volunteer to repeat it...again.

In any case refusing to help people till they help you seems a bit counter productive at best .. and pretty darn self centered at worst.

As long as you are on strike don't look me up... I'm boycotting strikers and protesters =)
Logged

Ahpre (aka Ahmaj)
I <3 Garden Gnomes
Guild Member
Sr. Member
*
Posts: 313


I'm dancin' as fast as I can


« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2007, 04:51:55 AM »

I love some of the answers, especially coupled with the incredulous "wow, why'd they leave" remarks in guild chat when another person heads off to other realms.  Regarding helping others so that you can be helped - pure MO BS.  There a a few peeps that help out but otherwise nada, unless of course you are looking for a heroic run or PVP, then the peeps running Kara regularly and pimped out perk up.

A friend seemed shocked to find I was revered with almost every faction needed for heroics considering the number of quests I still needed help with.  How? I ran the instances when someone needed help (as long as the requests come before 10pm).  With the exception of my Kara and Arc keys I've not run an instance that "I" (still don't have my SL key for example) needed.  For the Arc key it took me 6 weeks trying with PUG's before a "guild" run finally succeeded.  I've never had success with them, period.

I remember early on getting ready for Kara I was asked to help with the quest chain in Netherstorm after a late guild run.  I was tired, but I went and tanked - 10 minutes total - end result someone with a nice blue to go into Kara with.   I spent 4 weeks trying LFG and GEM events for my group quests in Netherstorm.  We have people screaming that peeps should have "blues" for Kara - frell you and the flying mount you came in on.

Want to know who's interested in what - go take a look at the Armory pages.  And yes, the guild has run Romeo & Juliet - take it from someone that gets to watch the loot links in chat most of the time.

I think the thing that the 10-mans show the most is that it was not guild spirit that caused all the support pre-BC - it was simply the individual desire to have enough people available to run the end-game instances.

BTW, we have 3 new mains trying to get Kara keyed, thanks for the help, 5 mans on Sunday are a blessing.

PS.  Funny how it's crickets for the keying runs but I see responses left and right for the heroics - guess my defininition of busy is different

Logged
Jahira
Guild Member
Sr. Member
*
Posts: 251

Jahira Jahira
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2007, 05:28:16 AM »

Whats your point Ahmaj? 

I bet I've done nearly as many keying runs for people as you have regular runs period.  I was darn near exalted in all my reps on Fuscha and well into revered on Jahira before my first Heroic run. I got that by doing keying runs for practically anyone who asked me.  BM .. sure three time a day.. SL gotcha its only a 2 hour run at the worst... two or three times a day.  I'm talking about runs where I get no personal benefit whatsoever.  I'm just there to help.

Yeah I'm not a bit helpful.

I asked one time for help in guild chat.  20 people were on. I got zero response.  I sent out a couple of tells and had a guild group in 15 minutes. I'm not angry about it at all.

My start time is 2AM (server/EST).  Have you ever considered how hard it is to put on a heroic run that starts at that time? Let me tell you it took a lot of work and building some personal networks to get that going.

KoR raids and 5 man night starts at 2AM my time.  I have to reorder my entire day to attend those.  I was the most regular attendant for 5 man night for many months until it was interrupted by "kara continued".  When asked for groups my response to the raid organizer was "Any instance on either toon" 

I resent the continued venom and allegations that people who are well geared, well keyed, and who like to run Heroic instances are somehow doing a disservice to the people who, because they are newly 70, or because they have low play time availability, or low personal initiative are not keyed/repped/geared.



Seems like a lot of anger and no direction.
Then again my experience with the guild has been that personal contact is far more productive than ranting.

Logged

Jaxartes
Greetings, My Minions,
Guild Member
Hero Member
*
Posts: 2978


Herder of cats


« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2007, 06:41:20 AM »

Hm.  Guild support.  Sure, there's guild support.  But I think there's a difference between "guild support" and "guildie support."

GUILD support would be the guild marshalling its resources in the furtherance of it's goals.  Membership drives for keying runs, supply of precious items for rare or exotic crafting needs, forming and leading raids, these are guild support.  As nearly as I can tell, the guild support there has always been pretty good, all the way from MC to now.

Don't confuse guild support with OFFICER abuse.  How many million times do you think Frosh is going to want to run Shadow Labs before he starts spontaneously falling asleep at the mention of the name?  How many varieties of "Hey Frosh, come here and run my alt through this instance.  Chop-chop, Move it, beeyotch,"  do you think he's heard?  Officers play to have fun, too.  That ours tend to be pretty generous in helping our more challenged players get through their trials is just a bonus.  BTW, I just use Frosh as an example.  Lots of our officers are really good about this.  It doesn't mean that taking a title called "officer" is the same as "quest monkey."  I'm not saying Ahmaj or Elvis are doing so here, but I see this A LOT.

GUILDIE support is guildies just looking out for each other.  Frankly, yeah, we aren't great at that.  I know I personally have a tendency to space out when I'm grinding and look over at the chat window every fifteen minutes or so.  If you don't hit me up within a fairly narrow time window it will be hard for me to go instancing.  The crickets chirping back at my plaintive pleas for SL and Mechanar runs haunt me still...Hell, I need runs to SL and Mechanar still.  I need the Mechanar especially for my head enchant.  I haven't had much luck with guildees getting those final couple runs I might need.  But I had lot of luck getting help from guildies for all the other runs there.  So, Jax gets maybe 20 good runs with guildies, and then things slow a bit.  Doesn't change the fact I got those twenty good runs so far.  I understand that most of the guild mains have moved beyond needing this content, so it's going to be a bit more challenging for me to get it.  Does NOT make my guildies unsupportive toads for not wanting to go back to places they've already done to death and which offer nothing to them any more.

Our guild gives plenty back.  Look at your Kara loot if you don't believe me.  Look at the new content we've unlocked thus far.  Look at how helpful our officers have been.  Also, questing isn't hard.  Sometimes a pack of guildies will go knock a bunch out, but I mostly just pug those.  Group quests tend to be short, nasty affairs.  You don't need a crack squad for most of them.

Anyway, the whole point is don't mistake a guildie support issue for an issue that is the guild not watching your back.  And I'm not trying to preach.  But we are a casual guild, and that attitude does extend to the motivations of the players both to help themselves and often to help others.  It doesn't mean the guild in general isn't helping out.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2007, 06:42:58 AM by Jaxartes » Logged
Vandred
Main Battle Tank
Guild Member
Hero Member
*
Posts: 1484


Master of Lewtz

BlackDracus
Email
« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2007, 07:54:41 AM »

I'll come out and say it, I am not a huge fan of many instances anymore for BC, period. Shadow Labs is a giant snooze-fest for me, the only instances I can sort of tolerate are Tempest Keep because damn do I love the aesthetics of the place. Groups are lucky I pay attention enough to tank in there without getting lost in all the cool shiny widgets.

So, I grant, when someone is looking for a group to run SL for rep, I'm not terribly interested. Or Shattered Halls, or Steamvaults, or whatever. This doesn't mean I flat-out won't do them, but I'd frankly prefer to be the court of last resort. I am much more willing to do runs to help for key quests, like Kara, or back in the day Onyxia/MC/BWL.

I PUG'ed my way through most of my gear acquisition and a good chunk of my various key quests, too. PUGing is not the end of the world, and you have to accept that people are not always keen on returning to an instance that they consider themselves utterly finished with. Part of a casual guild IS no pressure or "responsibility" to do things you don't want to do, including running an instance for the 105th time. I got revered with all my factions mostly through PUGs as well, with the occasional guild group here or there.

I understand how many of you feel, because I levelled slower than everyone else due to disenchantment with the game. I had a hell of a time getting people to go places with me because they were already doing other runs or had finished everything they wanted from the places I needed to go. So I PUGed, and I PUGed, and I PUGed. Sometimes that's just the way it's gotta be. Hell, I had to do the same thing when I was gearing Vandred for tanking waaaay back when, because the guild was already so far along that going to Strat or DM was boring and worthless to most.

To sum it all up, we are a casual guild. This means, among many other things, that players have no obligation or expectation to bend over backwards to help everyone at the drop of a hat. If someone doesn't want to run an instance to help someone get rep, well, that's their prerogative. I think you underestimate how many guildies we have that WILL do things like this, however, but don't rely on guildchat. Look at the guild roster of who's online, and send tells. Infinitely more effective.
Logged



Unbowed. Unbroken.
chemten
official /gquit machine
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 623


99645571 michael.boeckelmann@hp.com chemten10 chemten10
Email
« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2007, 08:19:34 AM »

as a healer, i find it hard to believe that you have so much trouble finding a group.  the in-game LFG works marvelous for me.  not sure why you are having trouble.  i know you would prefer a guild-only 5-man, but those days are long gone for almost every guild that raids unless heroic badge farming is needed/wanted.

just a short time ago, there were many people who could still benefit from normal and heroics runs.  where are those people now?  have they gotten numerous drops in kara to replace the greens/blues? or are they continuing to wing it with less than stellar gear?


as vandred said, most people have grown tired of the 5-man content.  how quickly did scholo get boring in pre-bc?  brd(haha, everyone knows this one)?  the same can be said for most players.  this is pretty much the reasoning blizz dropped the ssc and tk attunements. it is very difficult for people not already engulfed in the game to begin and catch up as needed, especially when it comes to reputations and heroics.
Logged

the official "i want to steal your phat lewts" fan club member
stealing your epics since 2004.
Frosh
I'm not as fast as Frostburn.
Guild Officer
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1751

stevenearhart@yahoo.com StevenAtHouse
WWW Email
« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2007, 08:33:11 AM »

as a healer, i find it hard to believe that you have so much trouble finding a group.

I don't think the original issue was finding 5man instance groups.  I think the problem was finding people to do World Group Quests.
Logged

Jaxartes
Greetings, My Minions,
Guild Member
Hero Member
*
Posts: 2978


Herder of cats


« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2007, 08:44:52 AM »

as a healer, i find it hard to believe that you have so much trouble finding a group.

I don't think the original issue was finding 5man instance groups.  I think the problem was finding people to do World Group Quests.

Quote from: Jaxartes
Also, questing isn't hard.  Sometimes a pack of guildies will go knock a bunch out, but I mostly just pug those.  Group quests tend to be short, nasty affairs.  You don't need a crack squad for most of them.

I always type too much.  A big huge post, and that's the only section that prolly hit the topic at all.
Logged
chemten
official /gquit machine
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 623


99645571 michael.boeckelmann@hp.com chemten10 chemten10
Email
« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2007, 09:29:07 AM »

as a healer, i find it hard to believe that you have so much trouble finding a group.

I don't think the original issue was finding 5man instance groups.  I think the problem was finding people to do World Group Quests.

sitting in shat trying to find people to do a quest in SMV or netherstorm probably isnt the best method then.
Logged

the official "i want to steal your phat lewts" fan club member
stealing your epics since 2004.
Nalen
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 673


Lives to antagonize Vandred. RIVS.


Email
« Reply #13 on: July 10, 2007, 04:10:26 PM »

I am usually fairly available most nights, but I typically wait to see if one of our up and coming tanks is there to run these quests or 5 mans, because it help them gain experience and gear. 
I for one have run more quests that I was already done with, more instances to get peeps keyed and geared, given most of world wealth in support of the guilds crafters, so I am not really sure what else I can do at a personal level.  But I do hear you Elvis, I have had trouble since KOR was born consistantly getting groups when i needed them and I still do to this day.

Like Frosh said I think the best way is to post on the forums and Gem.  usually on our off raid nights I am farming or looking to increase my rep to get exalted with the BC factions.  So hit me up, if I am available I will help.

PS- Nalen still has tons of quests in Netherstorm
Logged

Pages: [1] Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.4 | SMF © 2006-2007, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!